Why did Adam Choose to die?

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coccus ilicis
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Why did Adam Choose to die?

#1 Post by coccus ilicis » 1 week ago

And God proceeded to create man in his image, in God's image he created him; male and female he created them. Further, God blessed them and God said to them: Be fruitful and become many and fill the earth and subdue it and have in subjection the fish of the sea and the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth.

Note it says, God blessed them and told them to have children and fill the earth and subdue it. It addresses both Adam and Eve, and tells them to subdue the earth. It thereby indicates that Gen 1:1-31 was written by God and given to them at the time of their departure from Eden. God's account ends at Gen 2:4 a, with the words...This is the history of the heavens and earth in the time of their being created.

The Hebrew word used for “generation”, history in the NWT, is toledoth, which means “history, especially family history. ...However, Wiseman saw that the colophons in the ancient tablets always were at the end, not the beginning. Google: Colophon - an inscription at the end of a book or manuscript usually with facts about its production. He found that most of the old clay tablets had “colophon phrases” at the end; these named the writer or owner of the tablet; they had words to identify the subject, and often some sort of dating phrase. If multiple tablets were involved, there were also “catch-lines” to connect a tablet to its next in sequence. Many of these old records related to family histories and origins, which were evidently highly important to those ancient people. Wiseman noticed the similarity of many of these to the sections of the book of Genesis, Genesis Authorship

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But back to God's history of events. From what it says at Gen 1:27,28 we know that this account was written after the creation of Eve, and most probably given to them before they departed from the Garden of Eden. In Adam's account of the events, starting at Gen 2:4b he gives us the details of his creation. He tells us what his creators/mentors had told him about the creation of the earth outside the garden of Eden, (Gen 2:5). I found it helpful to think of the Garden of Eden as a kind of biosphere.

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Continuing with Adam's account of events. Now there was yet no vegetation of the field that was sprouting because Jehovah God had not made it rain upon the earth and there was no man to cultivate the ground, (Gen 2:5). So Adam was aware of the purpose for his being created, namely, to cultivate the earth. He also knew that the biosphere in which he had been placed was to serve as a training ground to fulfil that purpose. And Jehovah God proceeded to take man and settle him in the garden of Eden,(Gen 2:15). The earth outside was already teeming with life, Gen 1:12,20,21, but living creatures were also being created for the biosphere, as part of Adam's training ... Jehovah was forming from the ground every wild beast of the field ... flying creatures ... and began bringing them to the man to see what he would call ... each living soul, (Gen 2:19,20). This preparatory on-the-job training would enable him to fulfil God's purpose for which he had been created, namely to subdue the earth and have in subjection the fish of the sea ... the flying creatures of the heavens and every living creature that is moving on the earth, (Gen 1:28). During this part of his training, he noticed that unlike animal kind he did not have a mate. And Jehovah cloned a female from his DNA. Adam explained it this way: Jehovah God proceeded to build the rib he had taken from the man into a woman and bring her to the man, (Gen 2:21,22).

It appears that Adam was not aware of the purpose of the tree of life and the tree of good and bad knowledge, other than what he had been told, which was that he should not eat from the tree of good and bad knowledge lest[ he die, (Gen 3:5). Lest here means may or might, the same as at Gen 3:22, where it says: Here the man has become like one of us in knowing good and bad, and now in order that he may not, [lest he], put out his hand and live to time indefinite. With that Jehovah put him out of the Garden of Eden. So what Adam had understood from what God had told him concerning the tree of knowledge is that if they ate from it they might die.

God had not told him that if he ate from it he would surely or positively die, which is how Gen 2:17 has been rendered in English translation, but Jehovah had said: But as for the tree of knowledge of good and bad you shall not eat from it for in the day you eat from it to die you shall die, (Gen 2:17). Reading from right to left, see the snip from the biblehub interlinear below.

Image (highlight, underline, arrows and added text mine)

Adam had known the Elohim/Gods were able to bring animals to life and he had seen them die. He knew that they had powers that he did not have. So when the serpent said to Eve: To die you will not die, for [the] Gods know that on the day when you eat of it your eyes will have been opened, and you will have become like [the] Gods knowing good and bad, (Gen 3:5), the penny dropped for Adam. Eve had been deceived by what the serpent had said, but he hadn't, (Gen3:12,13). When he heard what the serpent said, he understood the significance of the tree. It was the exit door of the classroom, which allowed them to leave whenever they chose to do so. It represented self-determination, to determine for himself what was good and what was bad. He had been in the biosphere a long time and had possibly become a little bored, evidenced by his words: at last bone of my bones, flesh of my flesh, (Gen 2:23). He needed new challenges.

Another factor that played a part in his decision to leave, was that the serpent had belittled them. How so? At Gen 2:25 it says concerning them: and they continued to be 6174. arom, naked, which comes from the verb, 5783. ur - to expose or lay bare. Being naked hadn't bothered them.

But when Jehovah asked, "Who told you that you were naked. Although naked here, at Gen 3:11, comes from the same verbal root as above. Strong's 5903. erom does not mean literally naked, but is a term of belittlement, i.e. You will have to serve your enemies with hunger thirst and nakedness, (De 28:48). When the serpent had said: For Gods know that on the day they ate from the tree their eyes would be opened, (Gen 3:5). He had gotten Adam's hackles up and he had risen to the bait. He knew that there was the possibility that they might die, but decided to risk it.

The reasons for them leaving the biosphere of Eden are understandable from both a human and Godly standpoint in whose image they were made. That is why the serpent knew exactly which buttons to push, Google: to know what to do to get people to act the way you want.

Did God know that someday Adam would open that door and go outside? Of course he did. Would we have acted differently if we had been in Adam's sandals? And if they had not gone out at that time would humankind have remained in the garden of Eden as pictured by the WT Society, to live in protective custody forever and ever? I, for one, don't think that was ever God's purpose for several reasons, but that is something each one must think through and decide for themselves.
LRW~

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Bruno
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Re: Why did Adam Choose to die?

#2 Post by Bruno » 1 week ago

Karl

lynchpin
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Re: Why did Adam Choose to die?

#3 Post by lynchpin » 1 week ago

Hi Ci,

The question re living in 'protective custody forever and ever'? at end of your discussion.

I can ask the same - when humankind enter the Kingdom (whenever that time will be) would we be under continual custody or will we then be trusted (after being tested) to have complete freedom?

I'll take a look at Revelation just to ensure the situation at that future time. This is just a quick thought on my part now. Feel free to answer anyway.

Regards
lp

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coccus ilicis
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Re: Why did Adam Choose to die?

#4 Post by coccus ilicis » 6 days ago

lynchpin wrote: 1 week ago Hi Ci,

The question re living in 'protective custody forever and ever'? at end of your discussion.

I can ask the same - when humankind enter the Kingdom (whenever that time will be) would we be under continual custody or will we then be trusted (after being tested) to have complete freedom?

I'll take a look at Revelation just to ensure the situation at that future time. This is just a quick thought on my part now. Feel free to answer anyway.

Regards
lp
Great Question lp, do check it out in Revelation. I haven't dealt with it because it is a bit of a shock to the system, i.e. Rev 21:8 applies during the 1000 year reign. Quite different from how it was and maybe still is pictured by the WT org.
LRW~

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coccus ilicis
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Re: Why did Adam Choose to die?

#5 Post by coccus ilicis » 5 days ago

Bruno wrote: 1 week ago
Hi Karl,

Thanks for the movie clip, It makes one yearn for them to live. The tree of life is also mentioned in Revelation. It says: and down the middle of the broadway, down this side of the river and on that side there were trees of life producing twelve crops of fruits, yielding their fruits each month. And the leaves of the trees were for the curing of the nations, (Rev 22:2). So, to live forever is a deeply rooted longing. But I feel that if it were not a journey of continuous learning and progress, it would become an intolerable servitude. So what happens when humankind has fulfilled its initial purpose to fill the earth ... and have in subjection the fish of the sea the flying creatures of the heavens and every creature that is moving upon the earth, (Gen 1:28). What comes next? Rev 21:5 says that God is making all things new, a complete renewal of this old heaven and earth. But I have an inkling that this earth was just the beginning of what God has in store for those that love him,

Paul knew more than he let on. He tells us that when he was beamed up to a heavenly paradise/enclosed ecosystem, he heard things about which he was not allowed to speak, (2Cor 12:2,3,4). He alludes to what he heard at 1Cor 2:7 where he says: But we speak about Gods wisdom in a sacred secret, the hidden wisdom, the sacred things God foreordained before this system of things, [literally before the ages (plural)]. This system of things includes the earthly garden of Eden and God's overall plan for humankind. In support Paul cites the essence of Isa 64:4,8 and tells them that they have no concept of what God plans for them. He then speaks about the Pentecostal spirit that was given to them so that they might understand heavenly things, (1Cor2:11-13). But also tells them what they understand at that time concerning these things was partial knowledge that would be done away with when complete knowledge arrived, (1Cor 13:8,9,10,11).

What Paul had said concerning the future when complete knowledge arrived is recorded at 1Cor 2:9, check the parsing below the verbs. It is a little different from how we read it in our English translations. Paul used the aorist overview verb, what it says is: Eye sees not, and ear hears not, neither conceives the heart of man the things God prepares for those loving him. It really makes the future something to look forward to. We will see and hear what we need to know when the time comes.
LRW~

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Bruno
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Re: Why did Adam Choose to die?

#6 Post by Bruno » 1 day ago

coccus ilicis wrote: 5 days ago So, to live forever is a deeply rooted longing. But I feel that if it were not a journey of continuous learning and progress, it would become an intolerable servitude.
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Karl

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