Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

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Proselytiser of Jah
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Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#1 Post by Proselytiser of Jah » 1 month ago

I don't know if people here are familiar with Frank Viola. He released a series of books and podcasts in what he feels should be considered "authentic Christianity", and how most traditions, even teaching tradtions and forms of congregational gatherings in churches, all came from paganised Christendom.



Whilst there are some things he says I'm unsure about, or disagree with in some of his videos and writings, much of which he says is true.

One thing I noticed in one of his interviews (which I can't find at the moment) is that he said that "masses of Christians are recognising the pagan influences and are leaving the mainstream churches", and I would consider the JW Organisation to be one of these.

I have noticed increasingly of late, even within the community of PIMIs, more and more are starting to question or flat out disagree with the GB. I've also noticed more and more are doing indepentant Bible studies now, and have stated they disagree with the GB on a number of things. This is an ever building momentum. And usually it takes people in one of two directions; they get afraid and choose to submit to ultimate autocracy because they don't know what to do or where to go, or, the become like us, and realise, there is more to "true Christianity" than just the Org.

Now at one time I thought this was a unique case to JWs, that perhaps Jehovah is beginning to draw people out as more of the hidden secrets are exposed about the Org, and sending people his spirit to open their eyes to see the scriptures for themselves. But, according to Frank, this has been a pattern happening all over Christendom, and more people are seeking "social/non-demoninational" Christianity, they are beginning to see that a Congregation is not a denomination, but a gathering of like minded Christians, who can freely have disagreement, and yet have unity in Christ.

I don't know if it's a result to changing social climate, or if it's something beyond that, something Jehovah is making happen. Or if we are on the verge of the next "great awakenings". What do you guys think?
"The fruitage of the Spirit is; love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control..." Galatians 5:22-23

AmosAU
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Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#2 Post by AmosAU » 1 month ago

Hi POJ,

I can't remember if I have welcomed you to the forum, but will do so now. Welcome aboard!

I'm glad that you have posted this book by Frank. I read it several years ago. It's brilliant, and applies to every denomination claiming to be Christian OR Messianic.
I do believe that Frank and his co-author George, didn't go far enough. But then there are reasons for this.

I believe that this book is what could be reffered to as an update of Hislop's, The Two Babylons.

There is another book that I have that goes much deeper into facts concerning the origins of many beliefs, names, words, etc of the Christian and associated faiths. I'll post it here also. Titled, Come Out Of Her My People. (Rev. 18:4)

https://isr-messianic.org/publications/ ... eople.html

I believe this book could offend many due to the fact that they don't pull any punches. They tell it like it is. It's time to get serious about what we believe and where this belief comes from.

Regards, Amos.

Proselytiser of Jah
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Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#3 Post by Proselytiser of Jah » 1 month ago

AmosAU wrote:
1 month ago
Hi POJ,

I can't remember if I have welcomed you to the forum, but will do so now. Welcome aboard!

I'm glad that you have posted this book by Frank. I read it several years ago. It's brilliant, and applies to every denomination claiming to be Christian OR Messianic.
I do believe that Frank and his co-author George, didn't go far enough. But then there are reasons for this.

I believe that this book is what could be reffered to as an update of Hislop's, The Two Babylons.

There is another book that I have that goes much deeper into facts concerning the origins of many beliefs, names, words, etc of the Christian and associated faiths. I'll post it here also. Titled, Come Out Of Her My People. (Rev. 18:4)

https://isr-messianic.org/publications/ ... eople.html

I believe this book could offend many due to the fact that they don't pull any punches. They tell it like it is. It's time to get serious about what we believe and where this belief comes from.

Regards, Amos.
Thanks for that.

I also recently ordered the old "babylon mystery religon" book, which is a 90s edition, and I think may have been the final reprint. In very, very good condition, and at a bargain price (considering people are selling these rare books for over £100, which are usually tattered and falling apart). I know the book can be read free online, but things on the cloud may not always be there, so I do like to get physical copies of things for safe keeping (especially when people try to supress things they don't like).

I always keep my mind critical of course as I read, as it's easy to also make "false" connections, but at the same time, just knowing that these practices were in Babylonian religions and are not found in the Bible is enough, even if there is not "direct lineage".

As for Hilsop's book, it looked very interesting for sure, though I found it off putting to read some of what I found to be hypocritical statements, as he defended some practices which he admitted originated in Babylon and not the Bible, but went off the reasoning that "the Babylonians beat the Christians to the punch and had an instinictive insight to the true religion", which to me is a fancy way of saying "it's not in the Bible, but all the other religions are doing it, so it must be true".
"The fruitage of the Spirit is; love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, gentleness, and self-control..." Galatians 5:22-23

Strazh
Posts: 30
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Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#4 Post by Strazh » 1 month ago

Hi, POJ

I realized a long time ago that true Christianity is not a religion. This is obvious if you read the sermon on the Mount of Christ. True Christianity is the way from the rudiments of teaching to maturity. Maturity is the state when a person reaches the mind of Christ.

In general, how it should be.


As an organization, Jehovah's Witnesses know only the rudiments of the teaching. The Watchtower keeps them in a state of immaturity or spiritual childhood throughout their lives. In other religions the picture is about the same. Some people grow up and enter into an independent life and take responsibility for their actions. This is a state when you yourself distinguish between truth and falsehood and do not succumb to manipulation. At the same time, others remain forever in the thrall of their religion.
I don't speak English, so sorry for the mistakes and style.

Marina
Posts: 2499
Joined: 6 years ago

Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#5 Post by Marina » 1 month ago

Strazh wrote:
1 month ago
Hi, POJ

I realized a long time ago that true Christianity is not a religion. This is obvious if you read the sermon on the Mount of Christ. True Christianity is the way from the rudiments of teaching to maturity. Maturity is the state when a person reaches the mind of Christ.

In general, how it should be.


As an organization, Jehovah's Witnesses know only the rudiments of the teaching. The Watchtower keeps them in a state of immaturity or spiritual childhood throughout their lives. In other religions the picture is about the same. Some people grow up and enter into an independent life and take responsibility for their actions. This is a state when you yourself distinguish between truth and falsehood and do not succumb to manipulation. At the same time, others remain forever in the thrall of their religion.
Brilliantly put Strazh.
Marina

Phoebe
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Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#6 Post by Phoebe » 1 month ago

I realized a long time ago that true Christianity is not a religion. This is obvious if you read the sermon on the Mount of Christ. True Christianity is the way from the rudiments of teaching to maturity. Maturity is the state when a person reaches the mind of Christ.
Nicely said. 👏

The maturity that we yearn for is held in ‘The Way’ and in the sermon on the Mount.
It’s the path that leads us there....although perfection in the attainment seemingly evades us in this life course.

Thankfully we have hope and faith in a promise. That is SUCH a gift. 💐

Strazh
Posts: 30
Joined: 9 months ago

Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#7 Post by Strazh » 1 month ago

Thank you Marina,
thank you Phoebe

As you can see, the main idea is not mine. It is obvious from the Sermon on the Mount. Therefore, the end of ALL religions is inevitable, including the Watchtower Witnesses.

The "Great Exodus" is ahead. :)
To put it more precisely, the birth of a new spiritual nation is ahead. Isaiah 66:5-9.
I don't speak English, so sorry for the mistakes and style.

Bobcat
Posts: 3813
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Mass Exodus from Institutional Churches

#8 Post by Bobcat » 1 month ago

I made a post (here) that discusses this issue (the exodus from religion) from more of an historical viewpoint.

I see it as part of the fulfillment of Rev 16:12 and a sign of where we are in the stream of time. As Rev 16:13, 14, 16 shows, the situation moves from a falling away from religion (Rev 16:12) to the mounting of an assault on Christianity. (Rev 16:16; Zech 14:2a) The end result of peoples falling away from religion is a world that refuses to see things God's way. (Rev 9:20-21; And see here for how the 6th plague is paralleled by the 6th trumpet.) (On the meaning of the term Armageddon see this thread.)


Bobcat

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