Was Hitler Born Evil or did circumstances push him to be evil

Chat about anything you like here that doesn't fit under Bible Doctrines. Keep the subjects clean and refreshing to all.
Forum rules
Matt 18:6; Eccl 7:9; 1 Pet 4:8 (If you're not sure what they say then please hover over them with your mouse or look them up in your own Bible before posting)
Message
Author
Bobcat
Posts: 3316
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Was Hitler Born Evil or did circumstances push him to be evil

#11 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

Given the subject of this thread (Hitler), here is an article about someone of (arguably) equal reputation.


Bobcat

User avatar
Bruno
Posts: 2309
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Was Hitler Born Evil or did circumstances push him to be evil

#12 Post by Bruno » 1 year ago

This guy also has blood on his hands.

Image
Karl

Daniel12
Posts: 881
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Was Hitler Born Evil or did circumstances push him to be evil

#13 Post by Daniel12 » 11 months ago

I had an opportunity to meet a man who became a Jehovah Witness in the early 70s. He had just turned 18 and was about to enter college in the fall. During the summer a couple of Jws knocked on his door and preached to him. He showed us a copy of the book that convinced him they had the truth. The book was called “THE TRUTH THAT LEADS TO ETERNAL LIFE. I looked it up on Amazon and you can buy a new one for $42 American dollars, just in case some of you who are still studying - When do the 2300 days begin -----need more info. :P

He has kept his original Truth Book as a reminder of scams and delusions in humanity.

https://www.amazon.com/truth-that-leads ... B00005X0TS

He was convinced that he was living in the last days. But what really got him to commit to the organization was the teachings at the time that in a few more years, the end of 6000 years of man’s history was about to end and the only thing one could expect was the ushering in of the 1000 year reign of Christ to make it a complete 7000 years that would end the great sabbath.

When January 1975 finally arrived, he said he was terrified at having to endure the Great Tribulation. The last day of August was the most terrifying because everyone was expecting something to happen in October of that year. October came and went. Then November, then December and nothing. By January 1976 he knew he had been duped. He immediately signed up for college again and started the spring semester and got his PHD in psychology. His focus was in deviant behavior and its affects on groups of people.

In that same month of January, he told everyone he had made friends with in the WT organization Good Bye and told them he was leaving because it was all a religious scam. There was even a girlfriend he was planning to marry and she cried hysterically. He gave her a choice but she declined. Every so often as the years passed by, he would run into someone he knew from the local Kingdom Hall and they had some bad news about something happening to his old JW girlfriend. First she was raped by a MS in the congregation. The elders told her to forgive the MS because he was repentant. He was removed from MS but reappointed about 5 years afterward and eventually became an elder and married some pioneer sister. The sister he raped had his child and raised him by herself. When the child turned teenager he made friends with the wrong crowd and was murdered. The sister got cancer a few years later and died.

My new friend who was already happily married with kids still was distraught when he kept hearing all the bad things that this sister had gone through in life. He said the misery was so bad, (many other bad things happened to her) that it would have been better if she had not been born. What's the point of having a good person like this jw lady suffer so much to prove some cosmic universal point about rulership :roll:

That's what got my new friend thinking in a new direction.

His career has been very successful and has now retired a rich man worth over 40 million dollars and has been married to the same lady heading towards the 50 years goal. He has kids and grand-kids that are all successful and no divorces in any of them. All of them are very level headed. He attributes his success to two things. One; leaving the Watchtower immediately after the 1975 failed prophesy and starting College right away. Two; He has stayed away from all religious organizations and churches and any religious fanatic who insists on preaching to him. He shudders at the thought of having stayed in the organization after the failed 1975 expectation and wasting all his life only to find out later in life that it was not the truth. :eek:

I asked him about his thoughts on Hitler, Was he born evil or made evil by circumstances?

His answer was extremely interesting. :o

Bobcat
Posts: 3316
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Was Hitler Born Evil or did circumstances push him to be evil

#14 Post by Bobcat » 11 months ago

That reminds me of Psalm 73.

User avatar
Bruno
Posts: 2309
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: Was Hitler Born Evil or did circumstances push him to be evil

#15 Post by Bruno » 3 months ago

Bruno wrote:
1 year ago


A monumental theological achievement
Reviewed in the United States on September 9, 2019
Verified Purchase
I came across the Kindle version of David Bentley Hart's "That All Shall Be Saved" after reading Hans Urs von Balthasar's celebrated "Dare We Hope: 'That All Men Be Saved'?"—a book that, even by expressing tepid theological optimism for universal salvation, does not cease to draw the ire of certain conservative Catholics. From Balthasar's book it became clear to me that a set of texts exist in the New Testament which appear to suggest that all persons, at the end of time, will indeed be saved (e.g. John 12:32), but Balthasar believed that these texts needed to be read against others that appear to suggest the possibility of eternal hellfire (e.g. Matthew 3:12).

Hart, by contrast, does not offer his readers a reluctant optimism, but makes an unapologetically full-throated and thoroughly logical argument for the eventual salvation of all. He argues that anything less would be inconsistent with God's very identity as the Good subsisting in itself, insisting that the received view—that a hell does exist where human persons and other rational beings are forever tortured—is nothing less than morally repugnant. Indeed: "Can we imagine—logically, I mean, not merely intuitively—that someone still in torment after a trillion ages, or then a trillion trillion, or then a trillion vigintillion, is in any meaningful sense the same agent who contracted some measurable quantity of personal guilt in that tiny, ever more vanishingly insubstantial gleam of an instant that constituted his or her terrestrial life? And can we do this even while realizing that, at that point, his or her sufferings have in a sense only just begun, and in fact will always have only just begun? What extraordinary violence we must do both to our reason and to our moral intelligence."

Hart offers a series of four meditations to advance his point, each presenting a different argument. The first relies upon the moral implications of creatio ex nihilo, the second draws upon Scripture, the third makes an argument on the basis of personhood, and the fourth challenges the view that hell is a necessary possibility incurred by human freedom. Each of his meditations was earth-shattering in its deconstruction of the prevailing theological wisdom, but it was the last that really shook me. In the theological circles that I frequent, the existence of an eternal hell is typically justified on the basis of God's respecting human freedom—on this view, hell is possible because it is the logical consequence of human freedom, which entails the possibility of rejecting God. Thus, given human immortality, there must be some place to which those who have rejected God descend after death. However, as Hart so gloriously points out, this argument is incompatible with another theological/philosophical idea that those in full possession of their rational faculties will choose the good. Someone with perfect information and free of neuroses and other impediments will choose the good, because rationality is inescapably oriented toward goodness—if a person dying of thirst rejected water, we would not say that that person had made a free, rational choice to do so, but rather that the person was insane. The choice to reject God must only be possible in the context in which some impediment exists to either freedom or rationality, and therefore, the choice to reject God utterly can never be free; it must always be the consequence of some imperfection that, in fact, restricts freedom. Our freedom is oriented toward the all-pervading and transcendent Good, toward God himself; no 'free' choice to reject God can logically ever be made, and thus nobody can ever freely choose hell.

I will have to contemplate and process Hart's theological achievement in this volume for some time longer. Not only does he challenge the received opinion, but does so in a way that clearly offers universal salvation as the most complete, most appropriate, most self-evidently correct culmination to God's act of creating. This is a remarkable volume, an arrestingly compelling challenge to the overwheming theological consensus, that any student of theology should read and contemplate deeply.

Based upon Harts reasoning above. Once Hitler is in full possession of his rational faculties he will choose the good and hate the bad, including his former self.
Karl

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests