What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

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Daniel12
Posts: 929
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What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#1 Post by Daniel12 » 2 years ago

I thought this would be an interesting topic to discuss. I have my theories that I will post later. But I wanted to get everyone thinking on the question.

There can be no denying that the fasting growing group in America, is those people who are identifying themselves as Non-religious.

From there, they eventually turn to Atheism.

Exjws seem to turn to Atheism more than any other religious organization, -------Why? :-?

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... is-rising/

Bobcat
Posts: 3840
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#2 Post by Bobcat » 2 years ago

Hi Dan,

And yes, it is an interesting topic.

Part of my view is summed up in this post, especially the paragraph that has the word "communism" highlighted.

But my full answer encompasses more than the factors highlighted in that paragraph.

In past times Satan used Babylon the Great to keep mankind under his rule. BtG went hand in hand with Gentile rulership. The two together (Gentile kingdoms & BtG) kept the largest part of mankind under his rule and worshiping him. (The same things Satan wanted of Jesus when he tempted him - Lu 4:5-8.)

Although the Jewish state under the Mosaic Law was always a target of Satan, it never threatened his realm due to not being a missionary type religion. Christianity, on the other hand, being given a mission to preach to the nations, did threaten Satan's realm (see again my linked post above). Satan's response was to develop a counterfeit Christian religion. (2Th 2:2-10; Corresponding to the 3rd Trumpet - See this post)

If you are following my argument here, the current era (from the time of Jesus until now) has these main features: Roman rule, followed by the fall of Rome and the rise of Christian ecclesiastical rule. Using Daniel chapter 7, the 4th beast being Rome. Followed by 10 horns who never rise to the power of Rome. (Rev 17:12) Instead, Christian ecclesiastical rule holds power over these. Following this is the rise of Democratic rule during the Enlightenment era.

Rome was a product of Satan's rule. He basically said so in Lu 4:5-8. If the rise of Ecclesiastical authority corresponed with the "Man of Lawlessness" in 2Th 2:2-10, then this also was an "operation of Satan." (2Th 2:9-10) The rise of Democratic powers, with their 'separation of church and state' represents a break from Satan's style of rule. For one, it gives mankind a say in ruling. This is quite different from the style of rule Satan described in Luke 4:5-8, where he alone decides who rules. This situation is described in Dan 2:42-43 (with the division in his kingdom) & Dan 7:8 (where the 11th horn has "eyes like a man's.")

I know this is a complex historical argument. But if you are still following, Satan has long used religion to keep humans under his rule. Christianity threatened that. In response, Satan created a nominal Christianity. But the rise of Democracy, with its separation of church and state, has gradually broken the link between nominal Christian authority and the Gentile nations.

Religion has lost a lot of its previous usefulness as far as Satan's ruling authority goes. The logical, and maybe the only practical step left for him is to leave off using religion as something to cement his rule. Thus, in recent times (last two centuries) you find the development of godless communism. On the democratic side of things, with the general separation of the state and religion, mankind has been free to leave off religion for materialism. All these factors have gone into the rise of atheism and non-religious lifestyles that proliferate now. All of it corresponds with the 'drying up of the Euphrates' in the 6th bowl of Rev 16:12-16 and is preparing the way for the situation described in Rev 16:16 which will presage the 7th bowl and the "great earthquake" of Rev 16:17-21.

As for exJWs (in general), Mt 5:13 & Heb 12:15-16 might have something to say. Certainly not everyone is described by these verses. But like you said, many tend to devolve into atheism.

Anyways, I better cut things short here so as to not have too long a post. But I did want to point out the more immediate factors affecting religious and non-religious lifestyles, as well as the longer term things that have affected this development.



Bobcat

Genesis
Posts: 333
Joined: 2 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#3 Post by Genesis » 2 years ago

Daniel12 wrote:
2 years ago
I thought this would be an interesting topic to discuss. I have my theories that I will post later. But I wanted to get everyone thinking on the question.

There can be no denying that the fasting growing group in America, is those people who are identifying themselves as Non-religious.

From there, they eventually turn to Atheism.

Exjws seem to turn to Atheism more than any other religious organization, -------Why? :-?

https://www.scientificamerican.com/arti ... is-rising/

People follow. Today it is popular to trust in science. Yesterday it was popular to trust in God. For certain it will all come full circle.

Daniel12
Posts: 929
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#4 Post by Daniel12 » 2 years ago

Hi Bobcat

If I read your information correct, you consider Babylon the Great to be pagan or gentile religions.
Quote;
From my perspective (and I'll try to be concise - maybe I write too much and help confuse the issue
First, I understand there to be two "great cities" in Revelation:
One is Babylon the Great (Rev 17:18), which I understand to be pagan or gentile religions viewed collectively.
Jws believe BTG to be “All” false religion worldwide and of course they exclude themselves since they are the True Religion.

The official Catholic view is this;
Finally the angel tells John: “And the woman that you saw is the great city which has dominion over the kings of the earth” (17:18). This again points to pagan Rome or apostate Jerusalem.
https://www.catholic.com/tract/the-whore-of-babylon

Reformers like Martin Luther viewed the Catholic Church as Babylon the Great

The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS Church) views the Whore of Babylon as all organizations not associated or against all faithful people in Christ.

They all seem to have something in common, and that is that BTG used to be a faithful woman, but it turned into a whore and invited God’s disapproval.

I like to focus on exjws first and why most of them become Atheist.


"One of the things that the JW's do well is show how all other religions are a crock. The Watchtower was very good at pointing out all the hypocrisy in other religions. And if you go back in their publications you will see how regularly they denounced practices they now embrace."

People became Jehovah’s Witnesses because they were more proficient in looking up scriptures in the bible to prove that some of the teachings of the other Christian religions were just plain false. Like the idea of being tormented forever and ever in a fiery Hell. Once a person saw for themselves that the dead are asleep and not burning in some unknown spirit realm, and once they read of a New Earth where people would live forever and there would be no more death, pain, and sorrow, it was a slam dunk.

They found the Truth. :D

But then in the 80s the publication, “The Gentile Times Reconsidered” started opening the eyes of many JWs. I think this started the rolling snowball effect. Then Ray Franz’s book added to this snowball effect.

Then the internet exploded and all the dirty skeletons of the Watchtower started being exposed regularly on YouTube videos, blogs, and books. Then all the recent child abuse scandals started being made public in the local TV and local newspapers.

Once a person realized the Watchtower religion wasn’t what it claimed to be, that 607 was not correct, and that if that was true, - - - then it became obvious that 1914 was not the beginning of the last days, and the promise of entering the paradise earth with out dying-------WAS ALL A SCAM!

:( Their faith was shattered.

https://cdn.images.express.co.uk/img/dy ... 131729.jpg

And here is the biggest motivator according to a big percentage of the almost 40,000 Exjws on Reddit that I kept seeing over and over for about two years.
I had bashed every other religion in the world as being false, I could prove from the bible that they were false, now I discovered my religion (The Watchtower ) was also false, and I could also prove it from the bible.


And now after all these wasted years of serving this God named Jehovah, introduced to me by the Watchtower Organization, I find myself all alone and with nowhere to go.
https://img.fotocommunity.com/lost-in-t ... eight=1080
I frantically tried to search for the truth, but where would I look? There were literally thousands of other religions that claimed to have the truth. All the other religions also claimed to have God’s word the bible.
But I knew that all the other religions had been proven by me to be false. The last one that I believed for 50 years turned out to be false also.
How could I now trust in a God who allowed me to join a cult and be tricked for so many years to believe false things.
So the only other choice I had was to become Agnostic,….. and from there I eventually became Atheist.
http://thetwinpowers.com/images/Finding ... h%2001.jpg

This is the popular exjw reply to why they became Atheist.

People of other Christian religions have a different story on why they became Atheist. I will touch on that in my other post

goghtherefore
Posts: 128
Joined: 2 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#5 Post by goghtherefore » 2 years ago

Some scriptures come to mind:

John 14:6...
"Jesus saith unto him, I am the way, the truth, and the life: no man cometh unto the Father, but by me."

Matthew 11:28...
"Come unto me, all ye that labour and are heavy laden, and I will give you rest."

There is no where to go! Jesus is the "to whom " could/should we go!

(John 6:68: "Then Simon Peter answered him, Lord, to whom shall we go? thou hast the words of eternal life.")

.02

goghtherefore
“This is My Son, My Chosen One; listen to Him!”
Luke 9:35

Daniel12
Posts: 929
Joined: 5 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#6 Post by Daniel12 » 2 years ago

The path towards atheism is different for religious people other than Jehovah’s Witnesses.

Most religious people other than Jehovah’s Witnesses were never indoctrinated to believe that their religion was the ONLY True religion and that survival of a coming Great Tribulation depended on using most of your life to preach the end of a system of things and support the organization with free labor and money.

Most religions just focus on telling their members that God loves them, to be a good person, go to church and please contribute. For Catholics, confession of your sins is something extra.

But the teachings of other religions are just something a person is born with. The subject comes up when you’re young and a routine is introduced, and then for the most part, ----most of it is dropped except for prayer.

As long as everything is normal and no unexpected tragedy crosses your path to start turning the wheels in your brain, and you grow up in a well-adjusted family with both father and mother staying married to the very end, life will takes its normal path.
Maybe “Normal” is not the correct word to use, but instead, the most desired path, one of peace and tranquility.

This path consists of a person growing up in a secure household, start working, get married, have children, then grandchildren, then retire, then reflect on his life and feel a sense of satisfaction, --------and at the same time for a brief moment, a sadness will envelop the mind, ---that it’s about to be over----
but only for a moment because life was everything you had hoped for.

2 Chronicles 24:15, 16 And Jehoi′ada got to be old and satisfied with years and gradually died, being a hundred and thirty years old at his death

But these days, with the world being so unstable, tragedy seems to be inevitable to the majority of people living on this earth. Maybe it’s because there’s more people, 7 billion screaming humans compared to 1 billion just 215 years ago.

http://assets.nydailynews.com/polopoly_ ... wd-jpg.jpg

With that in mind, you have the other person.

What other person!!!

The person who is born in a not so stable situation.
The person who at the age of 6 loses his mother or father or both!!!

https://www.everplans.com/sites/default ... l-main.jpg

Or the person who is raised in a stable family and grows up, gets educated, meets the girl of his dreams and marries her. And they have two lovely daughters that they look forward to raising. They have it all planned out. Buy them dolls, a doll house, pretty dresses, pony tails, the prom, college, first boyfriend, father walking his daughter down the aisle, grandkids and getting to spoil them.
And then on one average day at work, two police officers approach the man to tell him that his wife and daughters were in an accident. A drunk driver hit them at high speeds while they were stopped at a stopped light, waiting for the light to turn green.

They are gone---------- Just like that.

https://ak4.picdn.net/shutterstock/vide ... umb/11.jpg

Tragedy is the number one thing that starts people thinking that perhaps;

“There is no God”

Whether it is a personal tragedy, or some other person’s tragedy that you read about or see on the news, a tragedy can start those wheels in the mind turning at incredible high speeds, forming new pathways in the brain that are sure to stay for the rest of your life. Even the tragedy of your pet dying or seeing thousands of animals being killed for senseless reasons is enough to trigger the idea that God doesn’t care. :(

So what does this tell us about atheism?
Well atheism doesn’t make the person bad or good.

Atheism is just the lack of belief in a God,---- Nothing more and nothing less.
There are atheists that are exceptionally good people;
And there are atheists that are exceptionally bad people.

And isn’t this the same thing with Christians. There are Christians that are exceptionally good people and there are Christians that are exceptionally bad people that don’t reflect the tenets of Christianity in even the smallest sense.

The world we live in is very confusing. It makes no sense. Even bible writers acknowledged this;
Ecclesiastes 9
I thought about all this very carefully
People don’t know if they will be loved or hated,
and they don’t know what will happen in the future.
But, there is one thing that happens to everyone

We all die!

Death comes to good people and bad people.
Death comes to those who are pure and to those who are not pure
Everything is the same for everyone.
The same fate awaits the righteous and the wicked, the good and the bad, those who sacrifice and those who don’t sacrifice.

In this the good person is like the wrongdoer;

This is the sad thing about all that happens under the sun:
The same fate awaits everyone.
Moreover, the human heart is full of evil;
People’s minds are full of madness while they are alive,
But in the end, they all eventually die.
We are reminded that people’s minds are full of madness while they are alive,

How could it not?

All we have to do is look at reality.

We have to struggle to stay alive. Each day brings the possibility of us losing someone we love dearly, of our world being shattered. And each year we look in the mirror, we see a reminder that we are headed to the same place that kings, princes, slaves, lovers, thieves, and anyone you can think of that has ever lived on this earth, and has passed, and now lies quietly to see what happens.
Isaiah 14 “The world of the dead is getting ready to welcome your arrival. It awakens all the leaders of earth; Those who were powerful on earth are rising from their thrones. They all call out to him, ‘Now you are as weak as we are! You are one of us! You used to be honored with the music of harps, but now here you are in the world of the dead. You lie on a bed of maggots and are covered with a blanket of worms.’”
Atheism is just another group of people among the millions who have developed an idea based on their life experience. Their conduct towards other humans is actually what defines them and not their lack of belief.

I made a very close friend when I started 7th grade. We got close and worked as a team to take care of each other. This was an important time for us because we had just entered middle school and all 7th graders were picked on by 8th graders and up. We were the freshman and so we were the ones everyone picked on. Anyway we hanged out all through 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th grade. Then we were off to college. My friend got accepted in an out of State college so I threw a big party for him.

It was at this party that I found out something about my friend that I did not know. He was an Atheist. I was kind of shocked. How could someone that doesn’t believe in God be such a good friend?

I found out that about the same time he entered the 7th grade, the same time that all the other older students were picking on him, right before we became friends, his mother finally lost the long battle with cancer.

What a time to lose your mother huh! :(

This affected his and his father’s frame of mind regarding a belief in God. But it didn’t affect his behavior in the way he treated me and all the other students. Everyone liked him because he was just a nice, considerate human being.

It was that experience that helped me to start learning little by little that a person’s belief system is not what makes a person.

What makes a person is whether his conduct is good or bad.
Proverbs 20:11 Even a young man is known by his actions— by whether his behavior is pure and upright.
(Matthew 7:) You will know these people because of what they do.
Good things don’t come from people who are bad, just as grapes don’t come from thornbushes, and figs don’t come from thorny weeds.

So this is what I think of people who are atheist, Jehovah’s witnesses, Protestants, Mormons, Catholics and all the other thousands of different beliefs systems.

http://zone1.ibizaspotlightsl.netdna-cd ... 672389.jpg

We’re all in it together and there’s not much we can do about it. So I judge those who I welcome into my circle based on how they act or might act towards me and my family. What they say or believe doesn’t enter into the picture at all, but it’s what they actually do that matters to me.

Matthew 21
“Tell me what you think about this: There was a man who had two sons. He went to the first son and said, ‘Son, go and work today in the vineyard.’

29 “The son answered, ‘I will not go.’ But later he decided he should go, and he went.

30 “Then the father went to the other son and said, ‘Son, go and work today in the vineyard.’ He answered, ‘Yes, sir, I will go and work.’ But he did not go.

31 “Which of the two sons obeyed his father?”

The Jewish leaders answered, “The first son.”
Jesus said to them, “The truth is, you are worse than the tax collectors and the prostitutes.


What a person does is what counts.

Tragedy seems to be one of the main catalysts that starts the road down to a lack of belief in God.
And one thing to keep in mind, there is no scripture, no bible story, that will ever trump someone’s molded mind of atheism as a result of a personal tragedy.

A good example of this is Bart Ehrman, a New Testament Scholar and former zealous Christian. He admitted that the death of a close friend cause him to notice all the suffering in the world, like the 16,000 children that starve to death each day. This led to a long path the eventually led him to being agnostic and eventually bordering very close to atheism.

On another note, it’s important to take notice that his wife is a full Christian believer that rejects atheism, ------Yet the marriage works.

Because like I said;
atheism does not define who you are as a person, it doesn’t define your behavior or conduct, it is just a “Lack of belief in a God” Evidently Barth is a good husband that loves his wife very well and she loves the man whom he is and has become.
:hearteyes:

This is just my opinion based on reading many stories of personal reflections by people who became atheist. I’m sure others had different reasons but tragedy seemed to be the event the kept coming up over and over in the experiences I read. :D

Genesis
Posts: 333
Joined: 2 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#7 Post by Genesis » 2 years ago

Tragedies are a part of life. Death, sickness, accidents, murders, wars have always been a part of life since the Garden.

Every adult Christian since the first century has experienced tragedies and severe problems in their life. But not every Christian who experienced tragedies also lost their faith.

There is more going on than the tragedies that befall all mankind when a Christian loses their faith.

User avatar
Bruno
Posts: 2400
Joined: 6 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#8 Post by Bruno » 2 years ago

Daniel12 wrote:
2 years ago

I made a very close friend when I started 7th grade. We got close and worked as a team to take care of each other. This was an important time for us because we had just entered middle school and all 7th graders were picked on by 8th graders and up. We were the freshman and so we were the ones everyone picked on. Anyway we hanged out all through 8th, 9th, 10th, 11th and 12th grade. Then we were off to college. My friend got accepted in an out of State college so I threw a big party for him.

It was at this party that I found out something about my friend that I did not know. He was an Atheist. I was kind of shocked. How could someone that doesn’t believe in God be such a good friend?

I found out that about the same time he entered the 7th grade, the same time that all the other older students were picking on him, right before we became friends, his mother finally lost the long battle with cancer.

What a time to lose your mother huh! :(

This affected his and his father’s frame of mind regarding a belief in God. But it didn’t affect his behavior in the way he treated me and all the other students. Everyone liked him because he was just a nice, considerate human being.

It was that experience that helped me to start learning little by little that a person’s belief system is not what makes a person.

What makes a person is whether his conduct is good or bad.


...Tragedy seems to be one of the main catalysts that starts the road down to a lack of belief in God.
And one thing to keep in mind, there is no scripture, no bible story, that will ever trump someone’s molded mind of atheism as a result of a personal tragedy.

A good example of this is Bart Ehrman, a New Testament Scholar and former zealous Christian. He admitted that the death of a close friend cause him to notice all the suffering in the world, like the 16,000 children that starve to death each day. This led to a long path the eventually led him to being agnostic and eventually bordering very close to atheism.

On another note, it’s important to take notice that his wife is a full Christian believer that rejects atheism, ------Yet the marriage works.

Because like I said;
atheism does not define who you are as a person, it doesn’t define your behavior or conduct, it is just a “Lack of belief in a God” Evidently Barth is a good husband that loves his wife very well and she loves the man whom he is and has become.
:hearteyes:

This is just my opinion based on reading many stories of personal reflections by people who became atheist. I’m sure others had different reasons but tragedy seemed to be the event the kept coming up over and over in the experiences I read. :D

Hi Daniel,

I think you are right about why many people become atheist and doubt the existence of God.
Alex just posted a video about God permitting kids to get cancer. I think it’s good to be aware of the strength of the arguments atheists present us with. One reason why many people are turning to atheism is because atheists are very good at presenting their point of view. The internet is having a big effect. As Alex concludes, John needs a better argument.

I suppose as Christians we have to step up and do better https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ekeELle5g-o


Karl

John S
Posts: 1159
Joined: 6 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#9 Post by John S » 2 years ago

As far as Jehovah’s Witnesses , turning to atheism?

Sites just like this one....many I have seen for over ten years, are to blame.

Saying: ‘ ever since it was proven that 607 bce was not the beginning of the Gentile Times.....


Saying: ‘since its been proving 1914 was a false prophecy of WT’



Saying: ‘ The letters of all the Apostles are just man inspired, and they even admit to it....Paul testified he saw the future in a blurred way...so, really sine Paul was a bigot, we cannot believe anything he said is from God’


Saying; ‘ the concept the Bible puts forth that God will destroy people eternally for being evil is not love, so getting that message from the scriptures, EVEN THOUGH IT SAYS SO.....is unloving, and hence ungodly, evil in itself!’

And other things, too numerous to mention.

Yes, you.....who bring these false concepts and lies up on the forum day after day, are TEARING DOWN faith in God, Jesus, and the Bible.


I have proven here more than once.

1914 was the end of the Gentile Times.And 607 bce was the beginning of that 2,520 years , even Jesus referred to , the ‘appointed times of the nations.’


But, since a few moderators here do not believe these Biblical proofs, they are contributing to the atheism of new readers.

John S
Posts: 1159
Joined: 6 years ago

Re: What do you think is the cause why people turn to Atheism?

#10 Post by John S » 2 years ago

I’m not sorry to have to say this:

I throw down the gauntlet just about every week on one subject or another, because they are faith destroying in intent and as a result of listening to the false reasoning or lies of so called experts.

One time, for months...it was defending God’s moral stand on homosexuality. 1 Cor. 6

Another,

Some here who are the main supporters of this site, believe in evolution , rather than the Biblical account of Adam and Eve.

Many here, teach strongly....we are NOT in the last days,

And argue vehemently that all the prophesies of Revelation and Jesus’ end of the world scenarios were fulfilled in Jerusalems’s destruction on 70 .ce

These have stated flatly....that 1914 has been absolutely proven a false teaching.


Along with 607 bce


Some are saying the Bible and the gospels are all Tampered with, and no longer reliable .


Many or most, do not accept Jesus’ teachings about receiving the holy spirit rebirth.


Thats why I get involved here. I understand, that some readers, are like myself, coming to sites like this, because we want to learn MORE about God. And the TRUTH from the Bible.

NOT get our faith overturned , and become atheistic, unbelievers, doubters. James 1


So....I challenge YOU


Those who moderate here.

On any subject above,

Im throwing down the gauntlet . If you have the courage and the conviction.......to post this challenge....

I say.......


BRING IT.

God and Christ I will defend, and the Bible too.

Come with your best shot .

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