Stranger wrote: ↑
1 month ago
Kerry Huish wrote: ↑
1 month ago
Let's not take this thread off topic by side stepping or water down the serious issue raised in the opening post.
It is a serious issue, and the water is just right for the occasion I have no doubt.
The title of the thread has me thinking that you may be wondering if your baptism was ever valid.
Since I've never been baptized,
would I be required to join a church or organization and go through the baptismal procedures just to say I have a valid baptism?
Stranger, (Lu 11:22)
As far as I can tell, you are the first eleventh-hour worker in the vineyard that I have come across, no doubt there are more and there will yet be a great many more, before the end, (Isa 54:3,9).
There are problems with the criteria Kerry lists to gain God’s approval. But Kerry will have to sort those out for him/herself. But let’s examine what Jesus told his eleven disciples/taught ones. He said: ... All authority has been given me in heaven and on earth
...(Mt 28:18). What did he mean by that? Well, he had earlier quoted Ps110:1-3 (Mt 22:43) to his detractors, where David says ... The utterance to my Lord is, sit at my right hand until I place your enemies as a stool for your feet. The rod of your strength Jehovah will send out of Zion [saying] “Go subduing [as at Gen 1:26] in the midst of your enemies. You shall have your volunteers in the day of your power, in the splendour of holiness from the womb of dawn
... And Stephen had said that he saw the son of man at God’s right hand (Act 7:56). So at that point in time, he was still waiting on Jehovah to give him the authority to go and subdue his enemies. Therefore when he said ... all authority has been given me in heaven and on earth
... he was not referring to that, which would occur after the end of the period called the conclusion of the system of things
(Mt 24:3). But he referred to the authority that had been given him to make disciples of all the people of the nations, namely, non-Jews (cf Mt 15:24).
And so he said ...Go, therefore, and make disciples of people of all the nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the holy spirit, teaching them to observe all the things I have taught you. And look I am with you until the conclusion of the system of things
. The conclusion of the system of things, Greek, soontellia
= a completion, consummation of the age,
as used at Mt 24:3, where it clearly refers to the period prior to the son of man coming
in power and glory (Mt 24:30). And the word until
= until, as far as, up to
, is also clear. What Jesus had said was that he would be with them until
/as far as the beginning
of the completion of the age
, after which he would no longer be with them. This corresponds to what Jehovah said to the woman in the wilderness ... "For a little moment I left you entirely, but with great mercies, I shall collect you together. With a flood of indignation, I concealed my face from you but for a moment, but with loving kindness to time indefinite I will have mercy on you
... (cf Isa 54:7,8).
Jesus had spoken of a harvest time when the master of the harvest would send forth the reapers to harvest the field, and that they should collect the weeds and tie them into bundles (organizational structures), leaving any stalks of wheat lying fallow in the field. And told his disciples ... the harvest is the conclusion of the system of things
...(Mt 13:39). This first part of the harvest is described at Rev 14:15,16. Jesus also gave another illustration, dealing with a vineyard ...For the kingdom of the heaven is like a man, a householder who went out early in the morning
. [cf Ps 110:3 the womb of dawn], to hire workers for his vineyard
... and he went out again at the third hour to hire more, and again at the sixth and the ninth. Then finally at the eleventh hour
, he found others standing about and asked them ... ‘Why have you been standing about here all day unemployed?’
... and they answered ... ‘Because no one has hired us’ and he said to them, ‘You too go into the vineyard’
(Mt 20:1-7). The reaping of the vineyard is the second part of the harvest, as described at Rev 14:17-20. These eleventh-hour ones
have not been hired
, in that they have not been baptized and been told to make disciples of the people of all the nations.
So welcome to the company of workers in the vineyard Stranger, (Ps 110:3).
At the end of the day, the eleventh-hour workers were paid first and the ones who had been employed earlier figured they would be paid more, but to their consternation, they weren’t, and Jesus added the following byline to the illustration ... In this way the last ones will be first, and the first ones last...
So get cracking Stranger, there’s still lots of work to be done.