Chiastic Structure in Genesis

This is the place to discuss anything to do with scriptural doctrine. It is the primary purpose of this site, and most discussions will be here.
Forum rules
Matt 18:6; Eccl 7:9; 1 Pet 4:8 (If you're not sure what they say then please hover over them with your mouse or look them up in your own Bible before posting)
Message
Author
Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#21 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

Tadua, one of the writers on the Beroean Pickets web site, has started a series entitled, Confirmation of the Genesis Record from an Unexpected Source. Part 1 can be found here.

It appears to be about Chinese history as the "unexpected source."

At any rate, this thread seems to be as good a place as any to park the links to this series (for any interested, which very much includes myself). And since some of it appears to involve the LXX/SP corrected chronology of the Bible, here is the link to the post I made on that (for easy reference).

As new parts of the series appear on the BP site I will link them to this post.
Here is Part 1.

Here is Part 2.

Here is Part 3.

Here is Part 4.

Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Index

Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#22 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

I added Part 2 to the post above.


Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Indexcat

Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#23 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

I added Part 3 to post # 21 above.


Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Index

AmosAu3
Posts: 456
Joined: 2 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#24 Post by AmosAu3 » 1 year ago

Hi Bobcat,

This is indeed an interesting topic. I believe that Tadua has unearthed some interesting and important information. I have an 4 DVD series by a SDA pastor who was a missionary in China a number of years ago. This pastor came to similar views of the Ancient Chinese letter and word constructs as Tadua.

From others studies that I've done, there is some evidence that way back, some of the Israelite tribes actually settled in the North West of China, as in India. I know a Chinese lady here who said that her great grandfather told the family that they were descended from the Jews. Her grandmother has distinct Jewish features including her hair. These are quite distinct from typical Asian features.

To the topic, I've come to understand there are many somewhat hidden evidences that are now coming to light in various parts of the world. These are establishing various truths that were only partly seen previously. As Daniel recorded; Dan 12:4 But you, Daniel, shut up the words and seal the book, until the time of the end. Many shall run to and fro, and knowledge shall increase."

The "many running to and fro," was not to happen until....."the time of the end."

Regards, Amos.

Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#25 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

I added the link to part 4 in post # 21 above.


Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Index

Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#26 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

A write-up that tries to explain how Jacob was fooled by Laban into marrying and having relations with Leah instead of Rachel whom he was expecting.

The article also explains the verbal parallels in the account that link back to Jacob's fooling of his father to get the blessing of the firstborn. Laban uses the same devious methods that Jacob did. Or, as they say, 'What goes around comes around.' (Compare Gal 6:7) And yet, despite Jacob's not wanting Leah, she ends up producing six of the twelve tribes. (Compare Rom 8:28) God's purpose triumphs despite our best efforts to circumvent it.

A link back to here is included in the chiasm of the Jacob narrative which can be found in this post.


Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Index

Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis [Pattern to Genesis Accounts]

#27 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

Whilst researching something else on the book of Genesis, it came to my attention that there are 'holes' in the chiasms presented in this (Genesis) thread. For example, the tower of Babel chiasm (Gen 11:1-9) is followed by the Abraham Narrative (Gen 11:27-25:11). The Abraham Narrative (Gen 11:27-25:11) is followed by the Jacob Narrative (Gen 25:19-35:29). The Jacob Narrative (Gen 25:19-35:39) is followed by the Joseph Narrative (Gen 37:1-50:26).

Upon further inspection, the 'holes' all have a common denominator. They are all genealogical listings. And filling in the 'holes' reveals a larger pattern employed by the writer of Genesis. Wanting to see how it looks results in this (I 'raised' the genealogies for visual appeal/effect):

Flood Narrative (Gen 6:9-9:29)

. . . . Table of Nations (Genealogy of Noah's sons) (Gen 10:1-32)

Tower of Babel (Gen 11:1-9)

. . . . Shem's Genealogy (Gen 11:10-26)

Abraham Narrative (Gen 11:27-25:11)

. . . . Ishmael's Genealogy (Gen 25:12-18)

Jacob Narrative (Gen 25:19-35:29)

. . . . Esau's Genealogy (Gen 36:1-37:1)

Joseph Narrative (Gen 37:2-50:26)

I'm still looking at the pre-flood portion of Genesis. It does have a genealogy (Gen 5:1-32) followed by the account of the defection of the angels. It might be possible to lay out the pre-flood world like this:
The Fall of Man Narrative (Gen 3:1-24)

. . . . Cain and Abel Genealogy (Gen 4:1-2)

Cain Narrative (Gen 4:3-26)

. . . . Adam's Genealogy (Adam to Noah) (Gen 5:1-32)

Sin of Angels Narrative (Gen 6:1-8)

Putting these together in chronological order would look something like this:
The Fall of Man Narrative (Gen 3:1-24)

. . . . Cain and Abel Genealogy (Gen 4:1-2)

Cain Narrative (Gen 4:3-26)

. . . . Adam's Genealogy (Adam to Noah) (Gen 5:1-32)

Sin of Angels Narrative (Gen 6:1-8)

. . . . [Genealogy of Noah (Gen 6:9-10) <- Possible to put this here if Flood Narrative is reworked to Gen 6:11-9:29]

Flood Narrative (Gen 6:9-9:29)

. . . . Table of Nations (Genealogy of Noah's sons) (Gen 10:1-32)

Tower of Babel (Gen 11:1-9)

. . . . Shem's Genealogy (Gen 11:10-26)

Abraham Narrative (Gen 11:27-25:11)

. . . . Ishmael's Genealogy (Gen 25:12-18)

Jacob Narrative (Gen 25:19-35:29)

. . . . Esau's Genealogy (Gen 36:1-37:1)

Joseph Narrative (Gen 37:2-50:26)

There is a definite pattern the writer of Genesis is employing. And it does put the entire book of Genesis in an easily memorable order. I'm going to have to look at this more. The only thing missing from this is Gen 1 & 2.


Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Index

Bobcat
Posts: 3820
Joined: 7 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis [Pattern to Genesis Accounts]

#28 Post by Bobcat » 1 year ago

Just a follow up on my last post in this thread (post # 27). As it turns out, Ecclesiastes 1:9, 10 has proved true again: "There is nothing new under the sun." What I thought I had noticed in the post above has already been noted by others, and in far more detail too. This article on the use of toledoth in Genesis explains the pattern I was seeing in the way the material was organized.

I already had this article linked to in this post (second link), but, memory being what it is . . .

At any rate, the linked article has some fascinating observations about the structure of Genesis. If Moses was the person who compiled the book of Genesis (my belief) he certainly showed some of the 'wisdom' and writing skill that was his heritage from being raised by Egyptian royalty. (Ac 7:22)

On a technical note, what I have listed as the Joseph Narrative (here) actually begins at Gen 37:2. Gen 37:1 goes with chapter 36. I have tried to update that in the posts that have that. Apparently the people who first put the chapter and verse numbers in place in the 13th & 16th centuries AD saw things a bit differently.


Bobcat

Genesis Index
Return to Main Index

Stranger
Posts: 2241
Joined: 3 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#29 Post by Stranger » 1 year ago

Bobcat wrote:
1 year ago
As it turns out, Ecclesiastes 1:9, 10 has proved true again: "There is nothing new under the sun." What I thought I had noticed in the post above has already been noted by others, and in far more detail too.

Ecclesiastes has a way of regulating one's spiritual proportioning valve, no doubt about it Bobcat.

We all try to remember things we think are important, but sometimes we just can't recall everything we think we should, as long as we are joyful with what God tells us everything should be fine. (Ec 5:19-20 KJV )




Stranger

Marina
Posts: 2507
Joined: 6 years ago

Re: Chiastic Structure in Genesis

#30 Post by Marina » 1 year ago

Hi Bobcat - due to time I haven't been able to take in the details that interest about the chiastic structures you notice. I have a different way of assessing things which may hold a lot of similarities to what you are seeing, I don't know.

That said - I am very familiar with how our Father deals with time in the scriptures. You'll notice in Genesis the maths starts simple and ever so gently throughout the scriptures it increases in complexity as He shows you something far greater than any calendar and also what to look for when you have a question and need to do the next calculation. He teaches you how to look for the milestones that are important to Him. Fascinating how He does it - He makes it like a treasure hunt - the very opposite of the mind control the Watchtower uses. You want the info, you got to dig, dig some more and keep digging - then you find the answer and it is brilliant!

I don't know if that helps you but thought I'd share it.
Marina

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 13 guests