The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

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Bobcat
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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#111 Post by Bobcat » 10 months ago

This is an attempt to create an index to this thread (where "BD" = Beloved Disciple):
Subject . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . Post #

Accuracy of detail in 4th gospel, PDF . . . . . . . .115

Authorship of . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .119 (Links)

Bartholomew & Nathanael . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 42-44

BD Known by High Priest . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .58-61

Blood & Water Flow From Wound (Jn 19:34) . . . .114

"Bolt From Johannine Blue" . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .103

Chiasmus in 4th Gospel . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .See this thread

Differences Between Synoptics & 4th Gospel . . . 46-49, 87

Doesn't Negate Inspiration . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1, 22, 29, 31

Ezekiel's Influence on 4th Gospel . . . . . . . . . . . 118 (Link)

Fourth Gospel Written by BD . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 1, 26

"From That Hour ..." (Jn 19:27) . . . . . . . . . . . . 110

Gospel Writer Paired With Apostle . . . . . . . . . . 11, 69

"In Union With ..." (Jn 17:21) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . See this thread

Introduction, Links . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .1, 24, 88, 98

Is Jn 21:20-24 a Postscript? . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 104

Jesus Assigns Mother to BD . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .21, 50, 53, 54, 86, 110, See also this post

Jesus Choosing the Twelve . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .21

Jn 10:16 & Lev 23:17 (Possibly related) . . . . . . . See this post

Language Used in 4th Gospel . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 46-49, 87, 104, 118

"Many Abodes" (Jn 14:2) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . See this post

Mark's Mystery Disciple . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 32, 33, 39, 40

Opposing Views & Rebuttals . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .25, 27, 41, 56, 58, 66-70, 72, 74, 77, 78, 80
. . . Index to Specific Views & Rebuttals . . . . . . .83

Other Ideas on Who Is BD . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 32, 33

Others at Last Supper Besides the 12 . . . . . . . . 13-17, 21,23, 84, 85

Palm Fronds (Jn 12:12-13) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .117

Passover of 32 (Jn 6:4) . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .122

Ramifications of Accepting Lazarus as BD . . . . . .1, 89-91

Resurrection of Lazarus (Thread) . . . . . . . . . . . See here

Revelation & 4th Gospel Writing Styles . . . . . . . 119 (Links)

Rich Man & Lazarus Parable . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .100, 116 (Links)

Should Avoid Banging Head . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 70, 71, 73

Summary of Linked Views (from post #1) . . . . . . 34, 35, 36

Supporting Viewpoints . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 27, 92-97

"These" / "These Things" of Jn 21:15 . . . . . . . . .105, 106

"Truly, truly I say ..." . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 121

Various Views On . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .75

Was Lazarus a Boy? . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 101, 102

When Satan Cast Out (Jn 12:31, 32; 16:11) . . . . .See this thread

When 4th Gospel Was Written . . . . . . . . . . . . . 120 (Link)

Wikipedia Link to who Is BD . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .37

Who Was Said to be "Beloved" by Jesus . . . . . . . 17, 18, 20

Why Consider This Topic . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .28

Why Lazarus Not Mentioned in Synoptics . . . . . .100

Writer of 4th Gospel Judean . . . . . . . . . . . . . .38, 45

WT Believes BD is John . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . 107, 108

I'll add to and/or adjust the Index as needed. I added links to a few posts and threads to spice the index up a bit.


Bobcat

Bobcat
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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#112 Post by Bobcat » 10 months ago

[Reserved for Index Overflow]


Bobcat

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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#113 Post by Stranger » 10 months ago

Bobcat wrote: 10 months ago [Reserved for Index Overflow]
You have no appeal from my docket today Bobcat.

I'm stuck here in prison anyway.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MXBMd-XO0Yo


Stranger, (1Pet 1:12)

Bobcat
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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#114 Post by Bobcat » 10 months ago

A post on the blood and water that flowed from the pierce wound Jesus received while being executed: Here. This piece of information is only mentioned at Jn 19:34. (But regarding the spurious addition to Mt 27:49 see here.) Jn 19:25-27 shows that only the "beloved disciple" and several women were in close enough proximity to see this level of detail, which is probably why it is only mentioned in the 4th gospel account.

See post # 53 in this thread (here) for a discussion of who was at the execution site.

At Jn 19:34 in the NET Bible (here) there are a couple of footnotes (# 100 & 101) that are worth considering:
100 sn If it was obvious to the soldiers that the victim was already dead it is difficult to see why one of them would try to inflict a wound. The Greek verb pierced (νύσσω, nussō) can indicate anything from a slight prod to a mortal wound. Probably one of the soldiers gave an exploratory stab to see if the body would jerk. If not, he was really dead. This thrust was hard enough to penetrate the side, since the author states that blood and water flowed out immediately.

101 sn How is the reference to the blood and water that flowed out from Jesus’ side to be understood? This is probably to be connected with the statements in 1Jn 5:6-8. In both passages water, blood, and testimony are mentioned. The Spirit is also mentioned in 1Jn 5:7 as the source of the testimony, while here the testimony comes from one of the disciples (Jn 19:35). The connection between the Spirit and the living water with Jesus’ statement of thirst just before he died in the preceding context has already been noted (see Jn 19:28). For the author, the water which flowed out of Jesus’ side was a symbolic reference to the Holy Spirit who could now be given because Jesus was now glorified (cf. Jn 7:39); Jesus had now departed and returned to that glory which he had with the Father before the creation of the world (cf. Jn 17:5). The mention of blood recalls the motif of the Passover lamb as a sacrificial victim. Later references to sacrificial procedures in the Mishnah appear to support this: m. Pesahim 5:3 and 5:5 state that the blood of the sacrificial animal should not be allowed to congeal but should flow forth freely at the instant of death so that it could be used for sprinkling; m. Tamid 4:2 actually specifies that the priest is to pierce the heart of the sacrificial victim and cause the blood to come forth.

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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#115 Post by Bobcat » 9 months ago

A PDF (33 pages in length) discussing the historicity and archaeological accuracy of the 4th gospel: Here.

I placed the link in this thread because, while the PDF does not discuss the possibility that Lazarus originally wrote the 4th gospel account, it is interesting that the writer of the 4th gospel account showed himself so familiar with Judean and Jerusalem detail. Something you would expect of someone (such as Lazarus) who was a lifelong resident of that area, as opposed to a Galilean like John.

At any rate, regardless of who one views as the writer of the account, the PDF does defend the accuracy of the 4th gospel.


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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#116 Post by Bobcat » 9 months ago

For possible connections between Lazarus and the rich man and Lazarus parable of Luke 16:19-31 see posts 46, 59-61, 86 in this thread as well as this post.


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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#117 Post by Bobcat » 8 months ago

Here is a thread on Reddit AcademicBiblical that discusses the differences in the vegetation mentioned in each of the gospel narratives of the triumphal entry of Jesus into Jerusalem. In fact, Luke mentions no vegetation at all in his narrative. (Mr 11:8; Mt 21:8; Lu 19:36; Jn 12:12-13)

In a footnote (# 24) at Jn 12:13 the NET offers this:
The Mosaic law stated (Lev 23:40) that branches of palm trees were to be used to celebrate the feast of Tabernacles. Later on they came to be used to celebrate other feasts as well (1 Macc. 13:51, 2 Macc. 10:7).

And Constable's Notes says:
The waving of date palm fronds (i.e., branches) had become a common practice at national celebrations in Israel (Lev. 23:40). Palm fronds had become a national symbol (cf. 1 Macc. 13:51; 2 Macc. 10:7). They appear on the coins that the Jewish nationalists produced during the war with the Romans in A.D. 66-70. Used on this occasion they probably signaled popular belief that Israel’s Messiah had appeared (cf. Rev. 7:9).

It was interesting that only the 4th gospel account specifically mentions palm fronds. The reason I was cataloging this here was in case this aspect of the 4th gospel account may be subtle evidence of the writer being local (i.e. a Judean like Lazarus). I'm not sure if it does indicate a local writer, but in case it does I wanted to have the Reddit discussion linked to for future reference. The linked Reddit discussion does not delve into who the writer of the 4th gospel account was. I just saw the possibility and wanted to catalog it.


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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#118 Post by Bobcat » 5 months ago

Cross-linking to a discussion of the influence of Ezekiel on the 4th gospel: Here. The discussion continues for several posts.

At the moment I don't know if this will impact this thread's main topic. But it will be interesting to see if it does. I also updated the thread index.


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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#119 Post by Bobcat » 4 months ago

Just adding an interesting comment from Wikipedia (in the second paragraph) suggesting that Revelation and the 4th Gospel have different authors: Here.

I think, though, that the Wikipedia statement is suggesting that Revelation was written by someone other than the apostle John. This thread is positing that the 4th gospel was originally written by someone other than the apostle John.

Here is another Wikipedia article on the authorship of the Bible books usually attributed to the apostle John.


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Re: The Disciple Jesus Loved = Lazarus?

#120 Post by Bobcat » 1 month ago

A 25 page PDF discussing the possibilities of when the fourth gospel may have been written: Here.

Just for reference, I found the PDF link in this Reddit AcademicBiblical thread

There are some interesting thoughts expressed in the document. The writer seems to favor a pre-70 AD date for the 4th gospel. And the possibility that it was actually the 1st gospel account written. He assumes that John was the writer (and says that he assumes this). But his treatise is really about when the gospel was written.

(This post was added to the index under "When ... Written.")


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